Schedule and Call for Papers for 2010 AFCBS Conference

It’s not too early to make plans to come to next year’s conference.  The theme is “Baptists and the Cross:  Contemporary and Historical Perspectives” and will occur on August 30-31, 2010.  A tentative schedule is posted below:

Baptists and the Cross: Contemporary and Historical Perspectives August 30-31, 2010
Monday, August 30

  • 9:00 am Plenary session 1: Tom Schreiner (SBTS): “Atonement in the Pastoral Epistles, the Petrine Epistles, and Hebrews”
  • 10:25 am Plenary Session 2: Stephen Wellum (SBTS), “Baptism and Crucicentrism”
  • 11:45 am Plenary Session 3: D.W. Bebbington (University of Stirling and Baylor Univeristy), “English Baptist Crucicentrism from the 18th Century Onwards”
1:00-2:30 pm Lunch break
2:30-4:00 pm Parallel Sessions
6:00 pm Dinner
  • 8:00 pm Plenary Session 4: Glendon Thompson (Toronto Baptist Seminary),
  • “Preaching the Cross”

Tuesday, August 31

  • 8:30 am Plenary Session 5: Maurice Dowling (Irish Baptist College), “Spurgeon and the Cross”

10:00 am Chapel

  • 11:30 am Plenary Session 6: James Fuller (University of Indianapolis), “19th Century Southern Baptists and the Atoning Work of Christ”
12:45-2:30 pm Lunch
  • 2:30-3:40 pm Plenary Session 7: Danny Akin (SEBTS), “The Cross and Pastoral Ministry”

Make plans now to attend!  For those who desire to present papers on the conference them in the conference's parallel sessions, see the below Call for Papers.

We are currently accepting paper proposals for next year’s conference. We have a limited number of spaces (between a dozen and sixteen) available for the parallel sessions which should be about 5,000 words in length and able to be delivered in approximately 30 minutes. Potential speakers need to e-mail the Center (andrewfullercenter@sbts.edu) with a title and brief outline of their proposal as well as a brief resume before December 31, 2009. The topic of these papers must fall within the theme of the conference, namely, “Baptists and the Cross.” Submission of a proposal does not guarantee acceptance.

Posted by Steve Weaver, Research and Administrative Assistant to the Director of the Andrew Fuller Center for Baptist Studies, Dr. Michael A.G. Haykin.

Two Books on Jonathan Edwards Reviewed by Michael Haykin

Two new book reviews by Michael Haykin have been posted on the Book Review page.  Both of these books were written or edited by Doug Sweeney and focus on the theology of Jonathan Edwards.  The first book, Haykin says, "is without a doubt one of the best studies to appear on Edwards in recent years." It is Jonathan Edwards and the Ministry of the Word: A Model of Faith and Thought by Douglas A. Sweeney.  The second volume reviewed is a reader which highlights the writings of the heirs of Jonathan Edwards, the New Divinity school. Dr. Haykin believes that  The New England Theology: From Jonathan Edwards to Edwards Amasa Park (edited by Douglas A. Sweeney and Allen C. Guelzo) has great "potential for helping students of this era in American theological history appreciate the impact of the New Divinity men and their thought."

"Christ would have been more honoured by us": a word to Ontario Baptists about theological education

The history of theological education by and for Baptists in this province of Ontario makes for a fascinating story. By the grace of God an overview of this history will form a chapter of a forthcoming book I am planning on seven vital reasons why Baptists need to be deeply acquainted with their history.

 

In essence, I am convinced that in addition to the much good that has been achieved through Baptist schools in the past 180 years (the first school was actually in Montreal, Canada Baptist College, from 1838 to 1849), some major mistakes have been made that have hurt the Baptist cause here tremendously.

 

One of the most significant mistakes—and it is still a major problem—goes all the way back to that first school in Montreal: the failure of Baptists to provide financial support for their theological institutions. One of the major reasons why the school in Montreal closed was the lack of support from Baptists in Canada West (the name of Ontario before Confederation). As one Baptist leader said in 1853 about the negative impact that rugged individualism had had upon early Baptist life in Ontario:

 

“Had the Baptist of Canada laid aside their mutual jealousies at an earlier day, and concentrated their strength in aggressive movements upon the domains of sin and error, not only would our denominational statistics have reached a higher figure, but what is of infinitely more importance, Christ would have been more honoured by us…”[1]

 

Then there was the Canadian Literary Institute in Woodstock. The school grew to a peak of 253 students by 1874 and was enormously influential in giving shape and cohesion to the Baptist cause in Ontario—some of its key leaders like E.W. Dadson (1845-1900) and its first overseas missionaries, John McLaurin (d.1912) and Americus Vespucius Timpany (1840-1885) came from the school. But it took a heavy toll on the Principal, R.A. Fyfe (1816–1878)—that remarkable Scottish-Canadian Baptist leader, who might well be called Mr. Baptist.

 

Every school year between 1861 and his death in 1878 from diabetic complications Fyfe regularly taught six hours a day, five days a week. On Sundays he never declined an opportunity to preach and conduct Sunday School classes. And in the summers he would travel the length of the province raising funds for the school. In the entire seventeen years that he was principal he only took two vacations and all but worked himself to death.

 

And why? Far too many of the churches failed to see the vital necessity of theological education for their existence. It was all too easy to let others support the school or go to the United States for men. Not much has changed in the past 140 years! Baptist causes and churches here in Ontario still have the same mind-set.

 

What I am about to write may not be well received by some Ontario Baptist pastors and leaders who will read this, but let the chips fall where they may! If you are a Baptist leader in this province and have any interest in the larger cause of Christ and the health of Baptist churches in this province, you need to be ashamed of yourself if you are not making sure your church is behind the financial support of solid conservative Baptist seminaries in this province. And I am, of course, very biased with regard to such seminaries; for me, Toronto Baptist Seminary heads the list.

 

It amazes me that Baptist churches in this province who are deeply concerned about the advance of the Kingdom of Christ are so utterly blind to this vital issue. To be sure, they want Christian leaders, but they are not willing to put their money where their desires are. It is all too easy to let others do the hard work of financial support. And the reality is that theological education cannot be all that it aspires to be.

 

And don’t retreat—in Hyper-Calvinistic fashion—to saying that keeping theological schools needy keeps them near the Lord! The words of Andrew Fuller (1754–1815) when confronted by the refusal of Baptists to engage in missions are my words to you: God will do this work of theological education but he will do it by means of others who are more faithful in this than you!

 

Brother, you need to repent, and do the works befitting a leader of a local Baptist church! Remember 2 Timothy 2:2!

[1] “Regular Baptist Missionary Society”, The Christian Observer, 3, No.11 (November 1853), 168.

Responses to Conference on Baptist Spirituality

We have received overwhelmingly positive responses to last week's conference on Baptist Spirituality.  These responses have come from personal conversations, emails, and some have posted their reflections on the conference on the web.  I think Ian Clary was the first to post his thoughts on the conference here.  He especially enjoyed Kevin Smith's lecture on the distracted piety of African American Baptists and Greg Thornbury's paper on Baptist "Personal Las Vegas Moments".  Another highlight for Ian was SBTS convocation which he eloquently describes as follows:

Southern is celebrating their sesquicentennial this year, marking 150 years of their existence. Therefore convocation was especially poignant. I can’t tell you the feeling that surged through me when the massive congregation arose to sing “All Hail the Power of Jesus’ Name” and the whole faculty processed through the chapel. Looking over to see top evangelical theologians like Tom Schreiner, Stephen Wellum, Michael Haykin, Denny Burk, Bruce Ware, Tom Nettles, Brian Vickers, etc., being led by Albert Mohler and Russell Moore to their seats at the front gave me goosebumps. Being there really made you feel like you were a part of something big. When Dr. Mohler announced the signing of the Abstract of Principles – Southern’s faith statement – the gravitas and solemnity was everywhere in the air. Chip Stam and Brian Vickers signed the statement as new full-time faculty. With quill in hand, they signed the 150 year old document with pride.

By the way, Ian also presented at this conference in a well-attended and well-received breakout session on “Alexander Carson (1776-1844): Jonathan Edwards of the Nineteenth Century”.

Jeff Straub also provided his thoughts upon what he called "A Great Conference!" at Central Baptist Theological Seminary's Theology Central blog.  He writes about the Andrew Fuller Center the following kind words:

In recent times, much of the material by and about Baptists has come from writers inclined toward theological progressivism rather than confessional orthodoxy. I am happy to report that the AFCBS is trying to fill the void for a more confessional approach to Baptist identity.

The Andrew Fuller Center does seek to provide an alternative to moderate approaches to Baptist identity and we appreciate Jeff for recognizing these efforts.  Jeff also presented a well-received paper on the Prince of Preachers, Charles Haddon Spurgeon.

Crawford Gribben is celebrating the conference by giving away one of the free books that we gave him.  He doesn't say much about the conference, but I know he enjoyed it.  :)  Meeting Crawford was one of the highlights of the conference for me and so many others that I've spoken to since then. His paper on “Irish Baptist Piety in the 17th Century” led off the conference. Several people have commented on both his friendliness and brilliance.  If you don't know Crawford, you can see the numerous books he has written or contributed to here.

Finally, Aaron Menikoff has posted his reflections on the conference on "Church Matters", the 9 Marks blog.  He highlights a number of the presentations, but especially Greg Thornbury's and Greg Wills'.  Of Dr. Wills paper, Aaron writes:

There were many other presentations, but the last one I want to mention comes from my former supervisor at Southern, Greg Wills. He lectured on what he called the "piety of humiliation." This, he said, should be a distinguishing mark of every pastor. Instead of trying to be relevant at all costs, we ought to aspire to be holy. And here's the rub: holiness doesn't win friends and influence people--if anything it tends to alienate. He put it this way, "The gospel seems to lose relevance in proportion to our contrivances to gain it [relevance]." Nice.

Dr. Wills' presentation on “Relevance, Severity, and Spiritual Power in Baptist Piety”was indeed a highlight of the conference for many, including me.  I listened to it again last night, along with my wife.  It is a powerful and challenging call to be willing to suffer reproach for the cause of Christ.  I highly recommend that you listen to it.

There were many other excellent presentations.  In fact, I did not hear one which I did not truly enjoy.   Most of the audio has been posted here.  There have been some technical difficulties with a few of the presentations which we're trying to work out.  If those are fixed we will post the missing sessions later.  A special event that ended the conference was the late night discussion by Drs. Haykin and Yarnell: “Reformed and Anabaptist: Strengths and Shortcomings of Two Traditions”.  Unfortunately, the first few minutes of Dr. Yarnell's first presentation is missing. It is hoped that this will be fixed as well, but until then the audio as we have it has been posted.  There is still over an hour of discussion for your listening pleasure.  You can access all the available audio of the conference here.

It's not too early to make plans to come to next year's conference.  The theme is "Baptists and the Cross:  Contemporary and Historical Perspectives" and will occur on August 30-31, 2009.  A tentative schedule is posted below:

Baptists and the Cross: Contemporary and Historical Perspectives August 30-31, 2010
Monday, August 30

  • 9:00 am Plenary session 1: Tom Schreiner (SBTS): “Atonement in the Pastoral Epistles, the Petrine Epistles, and Hebrews”
  • 10:25 am Plenary Session 2: Stephen Wellum (SBTS), “Baptism and Crucicentrism”
  • 11:45 am Plenary Session 3: D.W. Bebbington (University of Stirling and Baylor Univeristy), “English Baptist Crucicentrism from the 18th Century Onwards”
1:00-2:30 pm Lunch break
2:30-4:00 pm Parallel Sessions
6:00 pm Dinner
  • 8:00 pm Plenary Session 4: Glendon Thompson (Toronto Baptist Seminary),
  • “Preaching the Cross”

Tuesday, August 31

  • 8:30 am Plenary Session 5: Maurice Dowling (Irish Baptist College), “Spurgeon and the Cross”

10:00 am Chapel

  • 11:30 am Plenary Session 6: James Fuller (University of Indianapolis), “19th Century Southern Baptists and the Atoning Work of Christ”
12:45-2:30 pm Lunch
  • 2:30-3:40 pm Plenary Session 7: Danny Akin (SEBTS), “The Cross and Pastoral Ministry”

Make plans now to attend!

Posted by Steve Weaver, Research and Administrative Assistant to the Director of the Andrew Fuller Center for Baptist Studies, Dr. Michael A.G. Haykin.

Listening: a vital spiritual discipline

One of the most vital spiritual disciplines we can cultivate is listening—listening first to God; then listening to others. This is especially vital for pastors and other Christian leaders. But it is here so many pastors fail. They clearly fail to find people interesting, otherwise they would be asking them all kinds of questions. I am honestly fed up with pastors who are only interested in using me—and presumably others—simply as sounding boards.

Is it because they are so used to the sermon as the major form of their communication, that this is the only way they know how to communicate?

New Book on Abraham Booth

A new book by Dr. Ray Coppenger, A Messenger of Grace: A Study of the Life and Thought of Abraham Booth, is soon to be released by Joshua Press. In his day, and for many years after his death, Abraham Booth was regarded as one of the leading Baptist theologians and thinkers of the eighteenth century.  Relatively little, though, has been done, to explore his theological contribution to Baptist life and thought. This work by Dr. Ray Coppenger provides what amounts to a primer on Booth’s ministry and theology.

“Booth’s theological perspectives, particularly with regard to ecclesiology and soteriology, need to be studied afresh at the beginning of the twenty-first century, and I can think of no better place to begin the study of this mentor than this book by Dr. Coppenger.” Michael A.G. Haykin—Professor of Church History and Biblical Spirituality at The Southern Baptist Theological Seminary, Louisville, Kentucky.

ABOUT THE AUTHOR Dr. Raymond Arthur Coppenger was born in 1909 near the small town of Tellico Plains in the mountains of East Tennessee. Sensing a call to ministry in his twenties, he went to The Southern Baptist Theological Seminary in Louisville, Kentucky, from which he graduated with a Th.M. in 1936. After seminary, he served as associate pastor of First Baptist Church, Newport, Tennessee, and then as pastor of churches in Butler, Tennessee, and Pennington Gap, Virginia. After World War II, he went to Edinburgh, Scotland, for doctoral studies. He received his Ph.D. from Edinburgh University for his work on Abraham Booth in 1953. Subsequently, he taught philosophy and religion at Carson-Newman College in Jefferson City, Tennessee, Belmont College in Nashville, Tennessee, and Ouachita Baptist University in Arkadelphia, Arkansas. An emeritus professor since 1974, Coppenger continues to supply-preach and join in the ministry of his local church—and he does his best to keep up with his five grandchildren and five great-grandchildren!

Ordering details will be posted soon.

Posted by Steve Weaver, Research and Administrative Assistant to the Director of the Andrew Fuller Center for Baptist Studies, Dr. Michael A.G. Haykin.

Register this Weekend for Baptist Spirituality Conference

Time is running out to register for next Monday and Tuesday's conference on Baptist Spirituality.  You will be able to register in person on Monday morning, but there is no guarantee that you will get the free resources generously donated to the conference registrants. Download Conference Program

Register

Posted by Steve Weaver, Research and Administrative Assistant to the Director of the Andrew Fuller Center for Baptist Studies, Dr. Michael A.G. Haykin.

Tenth Free Book for Baptist Spirituality Conference

The tenth and final free book to be given away to registrants of next week's conference on Baptist Spirituality is Dr. Michael A.G. Haykin's A Sweet Flame: Piety in the Letters of Jonathan Edwards.  This volume has been generously donated by the kind folks at Reformation Heritage Books. There's still time to register for the conference and receive the three journals from SWBTS and the ten free books.

Posted by Steve Weaver, Research and Administrative Assistant to the Director of the Andrew Fuller Center for Baptist Studies, Dr. Michael A.G. Haykin.

Eusebeia 10 Now Available for Order

"A Heart Uncommonly Devoted to God": Theology and Piety in Jonathan Edward's Funeral Sermon for His Daughter Jerusha

A monograph by Joseph C. Harrod

Contents

5   From the editor

7   Preface

11  Chapter 1:  Jonathan Edward's Funeral Sermons

35  Chapter 2:  "A Heart Uncommonly Devoted to God":  The Life of Jerusha Edwards

49  Chapter 3:  An Analysis of Youth is Like a Flower That is Cut Down

63  Appendix:  A Letter of Jerusha Edwards

Available journal articles are in PDF format and viewable online using the free Adobe Acrobat Viewer.

Only limited articles are available online. For the complete journal, please order the print copy from the office of The Andrew Fuller Center for Baptist Studies.  Ordering details are available here.

"Dortian" Calvinism and "regular" Calvinism

Recently I was asked by hereiblog: Can you explain the difference between “Dortian” Calvinism and “regular” Calvinism? Historically, the first term has no history. Those using Dortian Calvinism seem to mean 5-point Calvinism and have coined the term after the Synod of Dort that made the 5 points important. If you read Calvinists prior to the last decade you can find nobody talking about Dortian Calvinism. But, from its usage it appears to be a bad term—and it appears that by it one should read “unevangelistic Calvinism.”

But many 5-pointers have been solid evangelists. For example: Bunyan and Eliot, Whitefield and Brainerd, the Bonars and Spurgeon. If by “Dortian” Calvinism we mean Hyper-Calvinism—what Andrew Fuller called “False Calvinism”—then that should be said.

Regular Calvinism: is this 4-point Calvinism or “evangelistic Calvinism.” Or is it Baxterianism? Or Amyraldianism? These are the terms that are used. Or is Regular Calvinism that of Andrew Fuller? Or that of Calvin himself? Historically, in Baptist circles, the term “regular” denotes closed communion. So it was used by British Calvinistic Baptists and Canadian Baptists in the 19th and 20th centuries.

It would be helpful for the terms to be defined. Here we can learn from that most careful of theologians, Jonathan Edwards, who always defined his terms.

More Freebies for the Conference

The Southwestern Journal of Theology is donating free copies of their recent issues on 'British Baptists,' 'The Bible,' and 'Baptists & Unity' to all conference registrants.  Thanks to Dr. Malcolm Yarnell and his assistant, Madison Grace for this generous contribution. You can still register for the conference and receive these three journals and nine free books.

Posted by Steve Weaver, Research and Administrative Assistant to the Director of the Andrew Fuller Center for Baptist Studies, Dr. Michael A.G. Haykin.

Free Books at "Baptist Spirituality" Conference

UPDATED The following books have been donated by kind publishers and will be available for free to all registered attendees of the Baptist Spirituality conference on August 24th - 25th. There are ten books that have been donated. The value of these books is well worth the price of registration! Register soon to ensure your spot at this year's conference! God's Rules for Holiness:  Unlocking the Ten Commandments by Peter Masters (Wakeman Trust)

Soldiers of Christ: Selections from the Writings of Basil Manly Sr. & Basil Manly Jr. by Michael A.G. Haykin, Roger D. Duke, and A. James Fuller (Founders Press)

Free Church - Free State:  The Positive Baptist Vision by Nigel Wright (Paternoster)

The Fear of God:  The Soul of Godliness by John Murray (Solid Ground Christian Books)

Southern Baptist Identity:  An Evangelical Identity Faces the Future, edited by David S. Dockery (Crossway)

An Introduction to the Baptists by Erroll Hulse (Audubon Press)

In God We Trust?  What is God Saying in the Midst of this Financial Crisis? by Michael A.G. Haykin (Audubon Press)

C H Spurgeon on Creation and Evolution: An Interview Conducted by David Harding (DayOne)

The Advent of Evangelicalism: Exploring Historical Continuities (B&H Academic)

A Sweet Flame: Piety in the Letters of Jonathan Edwards (Reformation Heritage Books)

Posted by Steve Weaver, Research and Administrative Assistant to the Director of the Andrew Fuller Center for Baptist Studies, Dr. Michael A.G. Haykin.

Arthur Henry Kirkby's thesis on Andrew Fuller

This past week I received in the mail from a friend, Dr Curt Daniel, a copy of Arthur Henry Kirkby’s 1956 PhD thesis, “The Theology of Andrew Fuller and its Relation to Calvinism” (University of Edinburgh). Of course, I had heard of this thesis but never seen it. The impression I had been given of it was that the work was second-rate. I probably derived this impression from the articles of E.F. Clipsham, “Andrew Fuller and Fullerism: A Study in Evangelical Calvinism.” The Baptist Quarterly 20 (1963-64).

 

But let me go on record and say that the work is excellent and well executed. Have read to page 143 or so and Kirkby ably sustains his argument that Fuller was a Calvinist of the stamp of the great Reformer. I would not follow Kirkby in his depreciation of the influence of Edwards on Fuller, but am so glad to have this work.

 

I am deeply in your debt, Curt. Thank you.

AFCBS in SWBTS News

The Hill - the online home for news from Southwestern Baptist Theological Seminary posted a story about SWBTS's own Dr. Malcolm Yarnell's participation in our upcoming conference on Baptist Spirituality.  The story actually highlights the dialogue between Drs. Yarnell and Haykin that is scheduled to take place at 9:00 pm following the conference's session on Tuesday, August 25th.  The origins and details of the event are included in the article from The Hill posted below:

FORT WORTH, Texas (SWBTS) – Southwestern Baptist Theological Seminary professor Malcolm Yarnell will join Southern Baptist Theological Seminary professor Michael A.G. Haykin in a dialogue about the strengths and weaknesses of the Reformed and Anabaptist traditions, Aug. 25.

This dialogue originated when Yarnell and Haykin posted a charitable interaction on the subject of the Reformed and Anabaptist traditions on Twitter, a social networking Web site. According to Steve Weaver, Haykin’s research and administrative assistant, their interaction “exemplified the kind of frank and humble dialogue that needs to take place between those Baptists who might identify more with either the Reformed or the Anabaptist traditions.” Weaver posted their interaction from Twitter and announced the upcoming dialogue on http://www.andrewfullercenter.org/2009/07/the-kind-of-dialogue-we-need.

Alongside his role as associate professor of systematic theology, Yarnell serves as the director of Southwestern’s Oxford Study Program and of its Center for Theological Research. He is also editor of the Southwestern Journal of Theology. Haykin serves as professor of Church History and Biblical Spirituality at Southern Seminary, and he is director of the Andrew Fuller Center for Baptist Studies.

Their dialogue begins at 9:00 p.m. and is open to the public without charge at The Andrew Fuller Center for Baptist Studies at Southern Seminary. The dialogue will follow a conference at the Fuller Center, titled “Baptist Spirituality: Historical Perspectives.” The conference will feature several speakers, including Yarnell.

For more information on the conference, visit the following link from the Fuller Center’s Web site: http://andrewfullercenter.org/conference/baptist-spirituality-historical-perspectives-august-24-25-2009.

Posted by Steve Weaver, Research and Administrative Assistant to the Director of the Andrew Fuller Center for Baptist Studies, Dr. Michael A.G. Haykin.

Jon Bloom of Desiring God Recommends In God We Trust?

Earlier this week Jon Bloom posted on the Desiring God blog a recommendation of Dr. Haykin's recent booklet, In God We Trust: What Is God Saying In The Midst Of This Financial Crisis.

This morning I read a booklet by Michael Haykin of Southern Seminary titled, In God We Trust: What Is God Saying In The Midst Of This Financial Crisis. He provides a brief survey of historical financial crises, beginning with Paul’s collection for the Jerusalem saints up through the Great Depression and highlights the spiritual fruit that came from them.

I love how he exhorts us Christians to be radically generous in the face of financial uncertainty since it is precisely during these times when our trust in God can be most clearly seen. . . .

The booklet can be read in 15-30 minutes and would be a helpful resource for families, congregations, Sunday schools, and small groups.

Posted by Steve Weaver, Research and Administrative Assistant to the Director of the Andrew Fuller Center for Baptist Studies, Dr. Michael A.G. Haykin.

The Dead Sea Scrolls at Toronto's ROM

What to say about the DSS at the ROM (Toronto’s Royal Ontario Museum)?

 

Fabulous to see these remnants of a bygone piety, for that is what they are. A longing for community purity and Messiah. The display was well done, very professional. Not biased against biblical faith. I felt that biblical faith was taken seriously. The historical intro was comprehensive and gave you the setting for the DSS as well as the scholarly disagreement over the DSS: their meaning and provenance. Very helpful in that regard.

 

But I missed a full scroll of the DSS. What was on display were fragments. It also could have been very helpful to have an audio guide. Considering what we paid (28 dollars entry fee for adults with another five paid for a guidebook) I think a little more could have been provided. Also at the end were a collection of holy texts: the Torah, the Bible (plus NT) and the Quran. I was honestly not sure what Islam had to do with the DSS. Another example of PC run amok IMO.

 

There is a second installment coming in October and will probably see that if I can (it claims to have the oldest copy of the 10 commandments).

The Kind of Dialogue We Need

Last night a fascinating exchange occurred on, of all places, Twitter.  I believe it exemplified the kind of frank and humble dialogue that needs to take place between those Baptists who might identify more with either the Reformed or the Anabaptist traditions.  Both Dr. Haykin and Dr. Yarnell demonstrated the ability to recognize the flaws and strengths of the historical groups with whom they may identify more or less strongly.  Take note at the end of the dialogue for a special announcement. Dr. Haykin:

@myarnell: last few days have been thinking much about Calvin's legacy: so much theol brilliance...but:

@myarnell: those who embrace his soteriological legacy must ask forgiveness from Anabaptist brothers. And why?

@myarnell. Because of his advocacy of the sword as a curb on heresy, esp Anabaptism in both its heretical and orthodox forms.

@myarnell: reading Eamon Duffy's recent revisionist history of Bloody Mary's reign has convinced me that some Protestant forebears erred.

@myarnell: they erred by being willing to use the sword to repress error. Like our 18th c forbears who were slave owners, they are flawed.

@myarnell: flawed models. But in so far as they followed Christ soteriologically they are safe guides. But their views of church & state:

@myarnell: the bottom line is still this: I am sorry that some of my Calv. forbears ever used the sword against Anab. brothers.

Dr. Yarnell:

@MAGHaykin Some brilliant thoughts here. Thank you for sharing them.

@MAGHaykin Shall we conclude that some of our Calvinist brothers have acceptable (though not necessarily always correct) soteriology?

@MAGHaykin And that our Anabaptist brothers perceived the doctrines of the church & the ordinances more clearly than our Calvinist brothers?

@MAGHaykin And, finally, that Calvin and the Calvinists were absolutely wrong when it came to the doctrine of religious persecution/liberty?

Dr. Haykin:

@myarnell: I think so: I am a Calvinist soteriologically but the ortho. Anab. saw more accurately NT church life.

@myarnell: And they were spot on re persecution. Calvin failed to reform the horrific legacy of relig persec from the Middle Ages.

Dr. Yarnell:

@MAGHaykin Don't tell anybody but I actually find much in Calvin that is brilliant too!

Steve Weaver:

Wow, great dialogue between @myarnell and @MAGHaykin! May I suggest an open late night discussion re these matters at the AFCBS conference?

Dr. Yarnell:

@steveweaver Some of the best theology is formed in dialogue, as 1 Cor 14 implies: Anabaptists called it Sittzenrecht or Lex Sedentium.

Dr. Haykin:

If Malcolm is up for it during the Fuller conference in August it would be great to do something re Calvin and the Anabaptists on state-ch.

Problem: is when to do it, we have full schedule. Maybe Wed morning if Malcolm can stay over.

@myarnell and @steveweaver: let me see if we can arrange a mid-morn event. Give me early next week. It would focus on Calvin & the Anabap.

Dr. Yarnell:

@MAGHaykin I have not made my flight plans yet so let me know if you want me through Wed morning.

Since this dialogue ended last night, both Dr. Haykin and Dr. Yarnell have agreed to a late night dialogue along these lines after Dr. Yarnell's presentation on Tuesday night at this year's AFCBS conference on Baptist Spirituality.  This dialogue will be open to the Southern Seminary community and the general public and will hopefully model the way two people with differing perspectives on some matters can yet recognize the strengths and weaknesses of one another's positions.

When: Tuesday, August 25th at 9:00 pm

Where: TBD on the campus of Southern Seminary (probably Heritage Hall or the Legacy Center)

What: An open dialogue with Drs. Yarnell and Haykin on the relative strengths and weaknesses of the Reformed and Anabaptist traditions.

This event will be open and free of charge, but you can register for the conference on which this dialogue will piggy-back here.  There is a great line-up of speakers, a Monday evening banquet meat and there will be several free books given away to those who register for the conference.

Posted by Steve Weaver, Research and Administrative Assistant to the Director of the Andrew Fuller Center for Baptist Studies, Dr. Michael A.G. Haykin.

Calvin's legacy: asking forgiveness from the Anabaptists

Over the last few days I have been thinking much about Calvin’s legacy: so much theological brilliance and so much to thank God for…but we who embrace his soteriological legacy also must ask forgiveness from our Anabaptist brothers. And why? Simply because of his advocacy of the sword as a curb on heresy, esp. his support of the repression of Anabaptism in both its heretical and orthodox forms. Reading Eamon Duffy’s recent revisionist history of the reign of Bloody Mary (Fires of Faith)—which I bought in Cork, S. Ireland when there a few weeks ago—has convinced me that some of my Protestant and Calvinist forebears erred greatly when they were willing to use the sword to repress error. Like our 18th c. forebears who were slave owners, they are flawed models. In so far as they followed Christ soteriologically they are safe guides. But with regard to the use of the state to repress error, we need to understand their views of church & state as an outcropping of the medieval Constantinian model.

The bottom line is still this: I am sorry that some of my Calvinist forebears ever used the sword against their—and my—Anabaptist brothers.